$1.2 Million Forgiven: How Two Doctors Found Student Loan Freedom

Season 3, Episode 6

Collectively, Drs. Tiffany Tavernier and David Thomas had an astonishing $1.2 million in student loan debt forgiven through the Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) program. While the two physicians have different medical backgrounds – Dr. Tavernier in radiology and Dr. Thomas in immunology – their individual student loan debt journeys share an unusual result: Neither one made a single payment on their student loans prior to forgiveness. Learn about the unique set of circumstances and timing that made it possible in this episode, hosted by Eric Sutton, Laurel Road’s Head of Design & Content.

Transcript

Eric Sutton [00:00:07] Hi, everyone. This is Eric and you’re listening to Financing Ambition, a Laurel Road podcast. Today, we’re going to talk about what’s on everyone’s mind these days: The new F word – forgiveness.

But first, a big announcement from Laurel Road. Earlier this summer, we launched Laurel Road Student Loan Freedom, our enhanced suite of student loan solutions designed to help borrowers manage all their student loan options in one place, including repayment, forgiveness and refinancing. And with this expanded offering, we are helping our members find financial peace of mind through freedom from the stress of student loan debt. So, joining me today to share their own amazing student loan freedom stories are two doctors who collectively have had over $1.2 million in student loan debt forgiven through the federal Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) program. And with our new student loan forgiveness counseling membership, part of the enhanced suite of solutions that I just mentioned, both of these doctors worked one on one with one of our student loan specialists to get there.

So, in today’s discussion, we’ll talk about navigating PSLF exactly how a student loan specialist can help with that process and of course, what it feels like when you find out that you’ve just had a very large six figure sum of student loan debt forgiven. So, without further ado, I’d like to welcome to the program today Dr. Tiffany Tavernier and Dr. David Thomas. Doctors, welcome to the podcast. Thanks so much for joining us today.

Dr. David Thomas [00:01:48] Thank you for having us.

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:01:49] Thanks for having us.

Eric Sutton [00:01:52] Alright, so let’s start off with a quick introduction, if you don’t mind, so our listeners can get to know you a little better. We’d love to hear about where you’re based and where you went to med school and did your training. And of course, how much student loan debt you have had forgiven.

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:02:09] I’m Dr. Tiffany Tavernier. I’m located in Houston, Texas. I’m currently an associate professor at the University of Texas Houston, working at Hamer Memorial Hospital. I went to medical school at Meharry Medical College in Nashville, Tennessee. I did my intern year in surgery at Vanderbilt University Medical Center. And I did my diagnostic radiology residency at Tulane University Medical Center in New Orleans. And then I did my one-year pediatric cardiology fellowship at Cincinnati Children’s. And I have been working at U.T. Houston. And my total loan forgiveness was $561,863.48. So, around $562,000.

Eric Sutton [00:03:09] Wow. Okay. That is a big number. I would look forward to hearing the details behind that and, of course, what that felt like. Thanks so much for sharing the rest of your background, Dr. Tavernier. First, let’s hear from Dr. Thomas about his background and forgiveness amount. So, Dr. Thomas, over to you.

Dr. David Thomas [00:03:29] Thank you. I attended medical school at St. George’s University School of Medicine in Grenada, West Indies, and I graduated in 2012 and subsequently did my internal medicine residency through New York Medical College at Saint Joseph’s University Medical Center in Paterson, New Jersey. I then attended the University of Connecticut School of Medicine for an Infectious Diseases Fellowship, and beyond that, I then attended a hematology and oncology fellowship at John C. Edwards School of Medicine at Marshall University in West Virginia. From there, I started clinical practice and was in practice as the Chief of Infectious Diseases at Lake Cumberland Regional Hospital in Somerset, Kentucky for the past five years through the pandemic and also their hospital epidemiologist. And last year I went 100% remote to get into an advanced fellowship in transplant infectious diseases at Moffitt Cancer Center and Research Institute in Tampa, Florida. After completion of that this July, I joined the Faculty of Medicine at the University of Louisville School of Medicine. I am the assistant program director of the Infectious Diseases Fellowship and director of Blood and Marrow Transplant Infectious Diseases for Brown Cancer Center. I believe the amount of forgiveness for me was around the neighborhood of $687,000.

Eric Sutton [00:04:50] That’s really incredible. I know our listeners are going to be very interested in hearing about how you got to that place and of course about your story. So, thank you both for sharing those details. Let me give some background to our listeners who might be unfamiliar with Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF). It’s basically a program available to federal student loan borrowers who work within the government or at some other qualifying nonprofit organization. And after ten years of repayment, which equals 120 qualifying payment months, the remaining student loan balance is forgiven.

The program has been around for a while now. It started accepting applications back in 2017, I believe, and as of July 2020, it has erased $69.2 billion of student loan debt for 946,000 borrowers. But here’s the thing – PSLF is also a notoriously complex program with frequently changing rules and requirements that are highly susceptible to political impact, I should note, as we look ahead to November here. And the thing is, not everyone – including many doctors – even realize that they could be eligible for this program. So, I’m curious to know, Dr. Tavernier and Dr. Thomas, how each of you first heard about PSLF and how you realized that you could be eligible. Did you know about it before you had that initial consultation call with one of our specialists? Dr. Thomas, maybe let’s start with you.

Dr. David Thomas [00:06:27] So, I actually heard about this all the way back when I was a third-year medical student. I was in my internal Medicine Corps rotation and the residents had a visit from a guest lecturer, basically for that day. And at that point in time, he started talking about basically an overall presentation on debt management, and PSLF came up there. And it was then that we learned that one of the strategies for managing the debt was to utilize income-based payment options to minimize payments to the balance with the idea of getting to the ten-year mark so long as you were working in a nonprofit setting.

Eric Sutton [00:07:12] So, essentially our specialists were able to help you get clarity on that program in those early stages, which is really good to hear. So how about you, Dr. Tavernier? How did you first hear about the program and what were your early conversations with a specialist like?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:07:29] I originally heard about the program in medical school, I think you usually have a lot of these kind of debt forgiveness people that kind of come through and talk about it. But from my understanding, when I was a medical student, you had to be in an area that was in need of physicians, and you had to basically practice primary care. So, it was kind of aligned to a certain amount of people that were doing like internal medicine or general pediatrics or family medicine. And you had to be from my understanding, it was like either in a rural area or in an urban area, but like kind of underserved, possibly serving in a community hospital. Then, I heard about it again in fellowship from one of my attendings. And she told me, yeah, you can do it as long as you’re working for a nonprofit because I’m in pediatrics and I’m working in a hospital because my subspecialty is usually with a hospital. She was like, you can definitely do it after a fellowship. We just have to make sure that. You’re at a pediatric hospital and don’t work in private practice. That was never really honestly something that I wanted to do was to go in private practice. So, I ended up working at a pediatric hospital. And then right when I finished fellowship, that was when COVID happened, and the world shut down. And then, you know, in 2021, Biden kind of talked about all the loan forgiveness. And one of my co-fellows was texting saying he had gotten all of his debt completely forgiven. And I was like, do you mind telling me how much you had forgiven? And he told me around 460,000. I was like, my gosh, that’s around the same amount that I have. And also, did you pay a single payment? Like, how did that work? And it’s like, I didn’t pay a single payment. I went to studentaid.gov and he said he had to call these numbers. And, you know, there was a lot of calling and checking and auditing and checking. And I was like, there’s no way that I could possibly do it – I don’t have time. I have a newborn, a six-month-old. I have a four-year-old. This is just not going to happen for me. So, I literally just Googled PSLF help and Laurel Road kind of showed up. It’s a free consultation, call this number. And I was like, What I heard is great, I can call somebody. We’ll see how it goes. I made a phone call, and they asked me a couple of questions about where I worked, how much I paid, etc., etc. And they basically told me that like within a 15-to-20-minute conversation over the phone that I could get my debt completely wiped away. And I was literally like, are you sure you 100% sure? Because that just didn’t sound real. He was she was like, yes. And I said, well, you know, how does this work and whatever? And she was just basically like, for you, that would be a one-time membership fee. Our specialist will help you. And, you know, basically kind of run through the whole thing with you. And I said, I cannot do this by myself. I have too much going on. I really do need someone to kind of, you know, ‘student loan forgiveness for dummies’ type of situation. And she was like, this will be the perfect program for you. And so, I started and it’s a great experience.

Eric Sutton [00:10:34] Great. All right. So, to wrap that up, you heard about forgiveness, through some of your colleagues. And then you had to sort of sort through a bunch of urban legend about like what is and isn’t applicable. And eventually you decided you needed help. And so, you were able to find Laurel Road online. And I’m really happy to hear that you did that. And here you are today with, you know, over half of $1 million forgiven. And same with you, Dr. Thomas.

And, you know, I understand that due to some very fortunate timing that both of you also ended up in that very unique circumstance where neither one of you had to make a single monthly payment in the program, which is incredible. So even though the PSLF program, you know, typically requires 120 qualifying monthly payments, you each had your entire balance forgiven without making any of those payments out of your pocket. So how was that possible? I need those details, and I know our listeners do, too. Dr. Tavernier, can we start with you?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:11:43] Sure. After I paid the membership fee for Laurel Road, I was contacted by a specialist via email, and then we kind of set up a time to meet and they basically walked me through studentaid.gov and how to look at all my debt. And honestly, I couldn’t even remember what it was just so long ago when you sign up for it during medical school, and then I didn’t pay anything through residency because I had a child.

So, I don’t know if you know anything about what you get paid as an intern, but it’s not very much. Probably like $3,000 a month, which is basically how much daycare would be for an infant, which it was my case. So, I didn’t pay anything through residency or through fellowship. And then you have about a year after finishing training and starting a job that you don’t have to make any payments. And so that year was kind of coming up. But then there was basically a pause on student loan payments because of COVID. And that was when I got wind of my co-worker telling me he got his debt forgiven and he was like, you missed the deadline. And he was like, why don’t you just try to see if you can get it done? There is an extension in October or something like that, and that’s when I Googled student loan forgiveness because I just didn’t know. I had to fill out forms about like where each place that I work and each place that I trained. But I guess in total it was ten years – from when I started my training to when I started working – it was 120 payments total because my residency was basically six years and then my fellowship was another year. And then when I started working was another four years. So, it kind of added up to ten years or 120 payments.

Eric Sutton [00:13:54] There you go. Okay. So, a combination of having all of those months that you were in training where you were on deferment. You know, COVID-19, obviously, where the government was counting those months as qualifying months. And then the one-time account adjustment is what you were referring to – originally had the March deadline – and that was extended. So, all of that together worked in your favor, and you had all those periods of forbearance and deferment stacked up that were all credited towards your PSLF and then added up to that 120 total qualifying payment requirement.

So, that’s an incredible story. You’re not the only one in that scenario. So, it’s really important that our listeners understand that that’s a possibility. How important would you say was the role that your student loan specialist here at Laurel Road played in helping you figure all of that out? Like talk us maybe through, specifically, how they helped or made that easier for you? I know you mentioned not having time. Is that one of the, you know, the biggest sort of features for you, or was there something more that helped make that easier for you?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:15:05] Sure. Being a working mom, I have two small children, one of them being an infant at that time, I just did not have time to kind of sort through studentaid.gov. It’s very non-user friendly. There’s a lot of like signing in and signing out and like, I just didn’t know what all that was about. I’m sure they walked me through that when I graduated from medical school, but that wasn’t a concern of mine at a point in time and then again in residency. It just wasn’t a concern of mine having a child during residency and then, you know, working, having these long hours. So even just starting again, I had had my second son at that point and started my new job again. It just wasn’t something that I had the capacity to really kind of search for on my days off to kind of work on how to do that. But I knew that it was an important thing for me, and it was something that I wanted to do. And because my co-fellow had gotten all of his loans forgiven, it was something that I really wanted to do.

But the specialist was actually, like, very, very helpful. They’re very down to earth and basically walked me through it, like told me to sign on to this like it was. I was like, please do this step by step with me because I’m you know, at that point I had a newborn, so I was like sleep deprived. So, they basically walk me through like, sign on this, put your password here, you know, print, you know, download these documents, email them to me. And so, they literally walked me through it like, handheld me. On the website you can make appointments with a specialist that, you know, kind of work with their schedule and they’ll call you and you’ll set up an appointment and they’ll kind of walk you through everything. And then they helped me send all that stuff in. And early on I did not get my loans forgiven. They had to like audit my loans or something because then I was like freaking out because I got an email. They’re like, you do not qualify. And I was like, What? You know, because I asked my specialist at least 2 or 3 times. Like multiple times – are you sure I’m going to get this for again? But like, I don’t want to get my hopes up, you know, my expectations of having this forgiven and it’s not. And they were like, yes, yes, yes. So then, you know, I once I got that email back from, I guess it was MOHELA that I wasn’t going to be forgiven. I made an appointment with a specialist, and I was like, look, like, what is this? And they’re like, we have to audit, or they have to audit your request. And so, they walked me again through MOHELA because I think it changed from Navient to MOHELA while I was doing this whole process. And so, they walked me through MOHELA and had me download all these forms and then sent me a lot of those things. And I think I actually gave them permission to kind of go into my accounts as well. That was possibly like a 2-to-3-month process. I was on pins and needles because at the end of that 2-to-3-month process was the beginning of my first loan payment. So yeah, but luckily it was like, you know, I was saved by the bell was probably like two weeks before my first loan was supposed to be due. My first payment was supposed to go through. The audit went through, and I was forgiven the whole of my loans.

Eric Sutton [00:18:16] Yeah, what a relief. Yeah, that’s something that we have to do frequently from what I understand is audit some of the findings and the qualifying payment counts that are coming from the government and or from previous servicers. So, it sounds like we were able to do that in your case too, which is awesome and saved you a lot of time – which really you didn’t have in the first place – in addition to a bunch of money. So, I’m glad to hear that was like a win-win for you, which is great.

Dr. Thomas, I’m sure as an infectious disease doctor, starting a new role at a hospital right around the time the pandemic started, obviously, that must have been a really stressful time for you, on top of the stress of having the six-figure student loan debt to worry about. So, let’s hear about your story.

Dr. David Thomas [00:19:07] So, listening to my colleague’s story here, it’s fascinating how much of this is similar. I heard about PSLF from this company that visited up there when I was on my student rotations and really didn’t think anything else about it except I kind of knew and locked away in my head, okay, this is going to be my strategy for getting out of this. And I started residency. And very similarly, as an intern signing the piece of paper, it looked like the most money I’d ever seen in my life. But when you actually get paid, it’s not all that much versus how much the rent is up in that area. Being inside the Gotham Halo – which is what I refer to the 100-mile radius around Manhattan – the prices are all inflated. And so, it was very expensive. Actually, the rent exceeded one full paycheck at that point in time. So, no matter how little the income-based repayment option was, it was still several hundred dollars, and I just couldn’t find it. So, I ended up just deferring things further. Alright, I’ll get to it in another year and another year and another year. And this kept kind of being the case all the way until I was through fellowship. And then having stayed in fellowship for so long, I went through three years of residency, two years of it, another year and a half. And then I just kind of stepped back because I was starting to have some health issues from being in training for that long, and decided I needed to just kind of recenter myself, start working, focus on family, friends and myself a little bit, and things kind of wound down. And I ended up finding a role starting the infectious disease division at Lake Cumberland Regional Hospital, where I am still Division Chief remotely. I spent the entire pandemic there. As you had mentioned at that time, I was starting to think about, okay, I need to get these payments started. And then they paused things. And being a new attending, it’s difficult to really control your cash flow into where it needs to go for things. All the while, I when I first moved into the house there, I didn’t even have a couch. And so, there was a period of time of just trying to buy the requisite furniture to live and trying to get a vehicle because I didn’t actually have a car at that time when I first came out of training. So, all of this was kind of diverting funds further.

And so, I decided to take advantage of the student loan pause while this was going on. I heard from a friend of mine who is – interestingly enough – also a radiologist, and he’s up at Brigham and Women’s. He tells me one day I got it taken care of. I’m like, what are you talking about? And he says, It’s all forgiven. And I’m like, what do you mean all of it? And he just sends me this screenshot of his phone from MOHELA where everything is zeroed out in my text conversation with him. He didn’t actually use a company to help him. He actually did it all himself and talked about the immense amount of work it was to do by himself. I kind of thought about that in terms of, well, it’s great that he was able to achieve that and at least it kind of helped it feel a little more real to me. It’s not just this concept. I know somebody that actually got their loans forgiven and it made me kind of wake up and pay more attention to it again. But I didn’t really know where to start. And seeing the consultation for my mother’s breast cancer scare with my colleague from medical school. She had actually been a customer and went through this process and told me about the company. So, I was able to reach out and get in touch with a specialist to discuss the situation.

And I was a little bit nervous because we were already past 1 or 2 of the cut-offs, it was supposed to be in October, and we were into almost January at this point. And so, I had almost given up on this. And then I decided to just kind of keep going and see if, you know, what we could get out of it initially and whatever, how many years I had to pay. Then I would face that when the time came. So, we got all the information sent out and there was a long period of time of just a lot of hurry up and wait where I got all this stuff filled out. And then we started sending them out to the different sites where I trained trying to get everyone’s signature for the program. And ultimately, I had to consolidate the loan, which they said was going to be 5 or 6 weeks and then it would transfer to MOHELA. At that point, I was really worried that we were going to overshoot the new deadline. And ultimately, though, it did come out okay and went to MOHELA. Then I had the biggest scare of all. As soon as everything kind of populated on the site, they weren’t counting any payments. So, I sent out sort of a panicked email to the specialists and got a response back saying, just kind of be patient. They’ll have to update everything now that it’s there and then they’ll count everything and then we’ll see where it all lands. And I remember it was probably about 3 or 4 weeks after that. I went and logged in and I saw that the counts exceeded 120 and went all the way to 137. And I had this sort of double take. I took a screenshot, and I sent it to my friend, the radiologist, who did this by himself, and I said, does this mean what I think it does? And he said, Congratulations. And then I contacted everybody, and they told me, yes, it looks like that’s going to meet the requisite payments. Now we have to wait for the verification process from the actual US Department of Education. Which was the longest three months of my life, but everything ended up fine. I just had this, like, kind of paranoia of what if something goes wrong now at the end? But it did not, and everything ultimately was forgiven, and I never had to make a single payment into the system.

Eric Sutton [00:25:35] Amazing. That’s amazing. So, yeah, it is similar to Dr. Tavernier, you know, where you had some months of forbearance and deferment like you mentioned. Obviously, some of the COVID-19 deferment was helpful. The one-time adjustment was helpful for you, and it sounds like our specialist was sort of able to help you, you know, sort of calmly wait for all of the count and everything to shake out. I mean, I think that’s something we hear frequently, is that you just need a little peace of mind, that what you’ve done is the right thing and that even if it doesn’t maybe appear up front, you know, we are dealing with like a government plan. And very frequently it just takes a while for those things to sort of iron out and the reporting to catch up with itself. So, it sounds like that’s what happened for you, which is really awesome, especially coming off the front lines of the pandemic, you know, that you were able to get that really, really good news about your student loan debt there. So same question for you then. Besides what I just mentioned, what role did your student loan specialist play in helping you figure it all out? Besides, like the peace of mind, were there was there any specific anecdote you could share with us about working with that specialist in a way that they might have helped you?

Dr. David Thomas [00:26:57] Everyone was very professional. Everyone was very helpful, and I appreciated that. It felt like things were really getting done behind the scenes and with how much of my attention was demanded at work during that period. Even at that point, that far into the pandemic, there was still a lot going on, and I don’t think I would have been able to do this the way my other colleague had on his own. And I think that’s really a testament to how effective of a service it is being provided to us and that everything kind of happened. And it felt like with the very few things I had to do in terms of setting things up on the actual FAFSA site to get the forms sent to the programs. Initially, it felt like everything almost happened automatically. In the end, it was a lot of waiting, but I didn’t really have to do very much beyond that.

Eric Sutton [00:27:52] That’s good to hear. I mean, it is a lot of paperwork, but I guess it doesn’t feel like as much when you’ve got some guidance and some people pointing you in the right direction, would you say that’s right?

Dr. David Thomas [00:28:02] Yes.

Eric Sutton [00:28:03] Okay, alright. So, it sounds like you got a ton of value. It sounds like you both got a ton of value out of your forgiveness counseling memberships, albeit short memberships, because you were both forgiven there in the first year. A lot of people do go on to have annual memberships because they are you know, they need to go through ten or more years of repayment, etc. But it sounds like you got a lot of value and that’s really great to hear.

So anyway, I just for our listeners, because, you know – with Laurel Road Student Loan Freedom, we offer two types of student loan forgiveness counseling memberships. One is the PSLF Counseling membership, which Dr. Thomas and Tavernier both took advantage of as eligible public service workers. And the other is our Income-Driven Repayment (IDR) Counseling membership, which is available to folks who are enrolled in the federal IDR program. And unlike PSLF, IDR is also a federal student loan forgiveness program that’s available to people who work in the private sector. So, IDR could be something to explore in a consultation if you’re not a public service worker, but you could still use help managing your monthly payments and ultimately moving towards forgiveness.

So, getting back to the discussion at hand, I’m curious to explore a little more of the emotional side of having a large six figure sum of student loan debt forgiven. You know, what did it feel like when you when you learned that total student loan forgiveness – first of all – was a possibility? And then exactly what did it feel like when it actually happened? Dr. Tavernier, let’s start with you, if you don’t mind.

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:29:47] Well, like I said at the beginning, when I first Googled just student loan forgiveness and Laurel Road kind of popped up and I got the free consultation and she kind of calculated all the numbers and the years and the months, and she was like, yours will be forgiven by March of 2023. I was like, Are you sure? Because it almost sounds too good to be true because you’re just, you know that you especially since I didn’t pay during residency and during fellowship, you know, it’s kind of something that’s in the back of your mind.

And I will say, like, it is also kind of in the back of the mind when you’re kind of picking your specialty. It shouldn’t be. But sometimes you’re also thinking about, okay, well, you know, if I pick the specialty, will I make enough money to repay my loans, you know, in a certain amount of time to be able to, like, enjoy my life? You know, when she said that, I was like, Are you sure? And I was like, what? What do I have to do? And I just kept asking, Are you sure? Are you sure? Because it just sounded unreal and just way too good to be true. And when she was like, you just sign up for this membership online and we’ll call you as part of these appointments. And like Dr. Thomas said, you know, you just kind of you go online and I don’t remember printing out anything. I remember just kind of downloading a lot of the documents and then setting them to the programs for which I worked. And then my programs all sent my stuff back very quickly, like maybe within the day or within like a week. It was all kind of there. So, like you were saying, it was a lot of hurry up and waiting.

You know, being a physician, you’re very results based. So, you know, when you do A, you’re expecting B and you’re kind of like, okay, well, what do I do now? And so, they’re like, you just got to wait. You just got to wait. And then kind of when that first email drop saying like, I didn’t have enough months, I was like, my God, what I do? And they were like, just calm down. They didn’t do this. And they’re very knowledgeable about that. So, the specialists kind of eased my nerves a little bit because, you know, whenever that kind of barb happened, they were kind of like, this happens all the time. Don’t worry, this is what happens. They kind of walked me through the process and made me understand why they said I didn’t have enough. So, you know, it was a lot of like easing my nerves and like, you know, everything will be fine, and it’ll happen. It was just, you know, really exciting. And I told my husband, and he was really excited about that. He couldn’t believe it. And I, you know, I slowly, like, start telling like a couple of my really close friends. But I was like, I won’t believe it till I actually get like the email, you know, that it was that it’s all forgiven. And, when you get that email, it’s just this huge sigh of relief. Like they’re like, my God, Like, that was just – it’s like almost like heaven sent, you know?

Eric Sutton [00:32:39] Yeah. I mean, student loans are a huge source of stress, particularly for doctors. So, I can imagine how amazing that relief must have felt. Did you do anything to celebrate?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:32:52] I took a vacation.

Eric Sutton [00:32:54] Nice. Okay. Where? Where’d you go?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:32:57] Yeah, we took a vacation to Jamaica Bay. So that was a family vacation. You know, we hadn’t really gone on a family vacation because of COVID and all that stuff and small kids. So, when all that kind of happened, it was kind of like we’ve been wanting to take a vacation anyway. So, it was kind of like a celebration at the same time for that.

Eric Sutton [00:33:20] That’s awesome. That’s really great. And what about you, Dr. Thomas? What was your emotional experience like throughout the process? And then, of course, when you finally saw that those loans had been forgiven, like you told us, what did it feel like? Was that a huge stress relief for you or what?

Dr. David Thomas [00:33:37] It definitely was a huge relief to me because the more I started to think about how much it would be to pay on these for ten years versus I was hoping to even just get the years of training that I had completed, knocked off of the ten, and it ended up actually falling over, which was a little unexpected, but I was hopeful for it. And when it actually happened, I also felt like it just didn’t feel real until the actual final discharge statement from them came saying, congratulations on your public service forgiveness and just kind of delineating everything that was forgiven, which just kind of showed the two lines and then that was it. And I it didn’t feel real to me, even though I kind of felt like it was going to go. I didn’t want to let myself relax. Until it was all completely said and done. And for that reason, I didn’t tell a lot of people about it until that point. There are some people I still haven’t talked about it because some people were rather judgmental about the fact that I carried that much student debt. And so, I felt like I was entitled to never, never let them know what happened to it.

Eric Sutton [00:35:05] That makes sense. In the end, did you do anything to celebrate once you finally got, you know, the confirmation in black and white?

Dr. David Thomas [00:35:11] I am hoping to sometime this Fall and everything kind of get confirmed over June as I was finishing up my advanced fellowship. And so, I’ve not really had the chance to do anything yet, but I’m hoping to.

Eric Sutton [00:35:24] I hope you do. Yeah, that’s really fresh. Well, hopefully you’ll be able to celebrate that. It’s definitely worth celebrating, I’m sure you’ll agree. And you know, I also feel like getting that amount of debt wiped away, that must have opened up a lot of financial possibilities for both of you. So, you know, let’s talk about what’s financially possible for you now that otherwise wouldn’t have been. You know, is there anything you plan to do with the money that would have been tied up paying back your student loans, Dr. Thomas?

Dr. David Thomas [00:35:56] So, I have actually started entertaining buying a house. Now that I’m up here and probably in a permanent position. And when I was thinking about that versus how much was going to have to go towards loan payments, it started especially with how the housing market has gone in recent years. I started to think I’m going to end up not being able to buy anything or at least not being able to buy anything that’s big enough to fit the family in. Right. And I feel like that is completely changed. And I am trying to work on getting rid of some other debts that are on the sidelines, raising up my credit rating a little bit before purchasing. And everyone kind of advised me to wait at least a year. So, I’m just kind of waiting and biding my time to try to do something possibly next year and I’ll be able to look at houses that are a little bit more what I idealized when I was younger than what I was thinking of last year.

Eric Sutton [00:36:55] That’s huge. That’s a huge milestone. That’s really great. Congratulations on that. And what about you, Dr. Tavernier? What financial possibilities are now available to you and your family now that you’ve had all of your student loan debt forgiven?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:37:09] We can put more into retirement and now we can kind of save more, put more towards our kids. You know, college funds, we can actually travel because there’s lots of places that we want to go to. I have family that is abroad in Asia that I want to visit, and my family hasn’t been able to see due to us having kids in residency, and then COVID happening.

So, being able to see them and not having it be such a burden with paying back that large sum of money every month. And that’s also helped me. I’ve been able to work part time, so it was always a goal of mine to be able to pay off all my student loans and then be able to work part time because I’ve always wanted to have time to be able to like to do other things other than medicine and to also be there for my children. And kind of now they’re at that age where they’re doing extracurricular activities. And when you have a nanny, it’s basically at least, you know, sometimes a third, you know, fourth of your salary going towards a nanny. So now I don’t have to pay be full time to pay a nanny to do what I would do. I can do what I need to do and still live very comfortably.

Eric Sutton [00:38:23] Yeah, that’s huge. That’s really great. Congrats to you on that. It sounds like you got some really good plans and very well-deserved plans. So, we’re getting toward the end of our time together today, I’m sorry to say. And I’m really grateful to both of you for sharing all these details about your personal journeys to student loan freedom and, of course, details about the experience you’ve had with our student loan forgiveness counseling membership. We appreciate that. And I have just one more question for each of you, and it’s a very important one. Knowing what you know about student loan forgiveness opportunities now, what advice would you give to an early career doctor who might be listening? Maybe something based on what you wish you knew about student loan debt earlier in your career. Dr. Thomas, could we start with you?

Dr. David Thomas [00:39:14] I would probably say to anybody that’s listening that this is possible. It is a real thing that you can achieve. And I really wish I would have found a better way to get started earlier. Honestly, I think that what I ended up receiving with this kind of forgiveness was an absolutely unexpected blessing on my life. It’s still worth going into the program, in my opinion, and minimizing how much you actually have to pay into these. With the result being that the remainder will be forgiven under the right circumstances. I think it’s definitely opened my eyes that we don’t have to sign on to this and be bound to it for the rest of our lives if we make wise choices.

Eric Sutton [00:40:10] Sure. It’s really good advice. And what about you, Dr. Tavernier? What’s what is your advice for our listeners?

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:40:17] Going back to what we said very early on, I knew people come in and talk about debt forgiveness and financial this and that while you’re in medical school and then you hear about this public service loan forgiveness plan, quote unquote, but you’ve never actually met anyone that actually reaped the benefits of it. I would tell them that it actually is a real thing and it’s a very tangible thing. It doesn’t necessarily mean that you have to be in an inner city working at a community hospital, or you have to be in a rural location serving, you know, a large circumference or mileage of people, and you can do whatever specialty you want.

So, I think it is a tangible thing. And to not have to, you know, put yourself in a little box thinking like, these are the only things that I can do to be able to get my student loans forgiven. I think you should be able to do what you want to do and do what you love and that, you know, with the right help you can get your loans forgiven. I would also say that probably contact to someone a little bit earlier to kind of help you navigate this and that. You don’t have to do this alone. You can actually, you know, have a specialist like they have at Laurel Road to help you. I think I would have looked for help a little bit earlier just to kind of relieve the stress and not have it be a weight on my back for so long.

Eric Sutton [00:41:44] Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Really great advice there, too. Thank you so much for speaking to that. And I’m sure it’s especially helpful both the advice from both of you for our listeners who are, in fact, early career doctors. So, thank you both very much again, for being with us today. And again, a huge congratulations to each of you on your newly found student loan freedom. All of us here at Laurel Road are really just super thrilled for both of you. So, thanks for joining us.

Dr. David Thomas [00:42:14] Thanks for having me.

Dr. Tiffany Tavernier [00:42:15] Thank you.

Eric Sutton [00:42:16] And as always, thanks to our listeners for joining us as well. Before we go, I do want to close with a brief update on the ever-evolving federal student loan landscape. For our listeners, we had an episode dedicated to federal student loan updates around this time last year when the payment pause ended and the changes to the IDR program were introduced. And those changes continue, and we anticipate even more changes as the election season heats up. At the time of this recording, here are a few important things that borrowers need to know:

• A federal court has issued an order preventing the Department of Education from continuing to operate the Save IDR plan. The Department of Education is currently reviewing that order, and they intend to issue guidance on how this impacts individual borrowers and their repayment plans.
• All new applications for enrolling in IDR plans and consolidating loans are paused at this time as a result. So, if you’re currently enrolled in the Save IDR Plan, your loan servicer has placed you on an interest free forbearance until the federal government issues more information.
• -Now, during this time, payments are not due, and you will not receive a bill. But it’s really important to note that this particular forbearance time will not be counted towards forgiveness through either the PSLF or IDRprograms.

So, for more information on federal student loan changes, you could always visit studentaid.gov, or you can schedule a free 30-minute consultation with one of our student loan specialists via the link in the episode notes. And for more information about Laurel Road Student Loan freedom, visit laureroad.com, follow us on Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn, and tune in to our next episode of Financing Ambition.

Episode Notes

Could you qualify for student loan forgiveness? Find out by scheduling a free 30-minute forgiveness consultation with one of our student loan specialists here.

Disclosures: 

Only the U.S. Department of Education is able to make a final determination of whether a borrower’s payment history is compliant with federal repayment programs. See student archives for more details. This podcast is produced for information purposes only and is not an offer or solicitation of any product, any views, opinions, findings and conclusions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the participants and do not necessarily reflect the views of Laurel Road or its affiliates. Laurel Road, KeyBank and its affiliates are not providing any financial, economic, legal accounting or tax advice or recommendations in this podcast. The information contained in this recording may not be current, and Laurel Road has no obligation to provide any updates or changes. Neither Laurel Road nor any of its affiliates makes any representation or warranty of any kind as to the accuracy or completeness of the information in this podcast, and expressly disclaims any and all liability around such. Our guests may receive compensation for promoting Laurel Road. Unauthorized use or reproduction of this podcast is expressly prohibited. Loan approval is subject to credit approval and program guidelines. Programs, rates, terms and products vary and are subject to change at any time without notice. Student loans, mortgages, personal loans, and credit cards are not FDIC insured or guaranteed. For more information and disclosures, go to Laurel Road AECOM. Laurel Road is a brand of KeyBank member FDIC.

This podcast is produced for information purposes only and is not an offer or solicitation of any product. Any views, opinions, findings and conclusions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the participants and do not necessarily reflect the views of Laurel Road or its affiliates. Laurel Road, KeyBank and its affiliates are not providing any financial, economic, legal, accounting or tax advice or recommendations in this podcast. The information contained in this recording may not be current, and Laurel Road has no obligation to provide any updates or changes. Neither Laurel Road nor any of its affiliates makes any representation or warranty, of any kind, as to the accuracy or completeness of the information in this podcast and expressly disclaims any and all liabilities around such.

Our guest(s) have received compensation for promoting Laurel Road. For more information and full disclosures, go to [Laurel Road-dot-com]. Loan approval is subject to credit approval and program guidelines. Programs, rates, terms and products vary and are subject to change at any time without notice. Unauthorized use or reproduction of this podcast is expressly prohibited. Student loans, mortgages, personal loans, and credit cards ARE NOT FDIC INSURED OR GUARANTEED. Laurel Road is a brand of KeyBank, Member FDIC, Equal Housing Lender and NMLS number 399797.